World War II

[juan]

World War II








Long ago, before many of us were even babes in our mother’s wombs, there was war the likes of which we can scarcely imagine. Most recently, it was thought worthy of the front page when in the battle of Iraq, a thousand men died. While that one thousand was one thousand too many, in the great World War they who died were not in the thousands but in the millions, the tens of millions. It may seem strange to us that so many give “the last full measure of devotion,” for a cause of “blood, toil, tears, and sweat,” but this wasn’t a battle for land or politics or petty grudges. It was a battle between good vs. evil… and good prevailed

As I write this, its May 5th, 2005 and sixty years have passed since the war and more and more I hear the story. Soon, very soon, on May 8th, it will be the sixtieth anniversary of V-E Day when the forces of evil were defeated and September 2nd when Japan threw down its sword. Now all those who fought the good fight are old grandfathers. They grew up in the poverty of the Great Depression experiencing misery the likes of which even the poorest of our time and place could not imagine. Either in America or Britain or Russia, they were there in a time of despair when the armies of darkness rose up to damn the world to eternal night.

Yes, with a blackened heart all twisted and ugly and full of bitterness, Hitler sought nothing short of world domination and the destruction of all goodness. Yet though he came within a hair’s breadth of final victory, he did not gain victory. Whether their flag was the stars and stripes, the Union Jack, or the hammer and sickle, when their countries needed them they were there. In a battle that raged across Earth, battles that ranged from the frozen Russian tundra at Stalingrad and Moscow to the steaming jungles of Guadalcanal and the Philippines, from the dry deserts of North Africa’s El Alemein to the waters of the Atlantic, Pacific, and Indian Oceans, and more places than could ever be named brave soldiers fought the good fight.

When asked of their experiences, many of these now old men do not feel that they were heroes. Speaking with sincerity and true humility, these men, now eighty and even ninety years old, said that they only did their duty and that the real heroes are those who didn’t make it back. Perhaps so, but in doing that duty, these courageous men saved the world from the greatest evil it has even known. Had they failed, who knows what unholy darkness might have poisoned the Earth and have kept its cancerous grip until the end of time.

But in the end, the United Nations of Britain, America, Russia, France, China, Canada, Egypt, Mexico, Greece, Australia, India and many more won. How else could it have ended? The price was high, almost too high, with an entire continent destroyed and whole nations in ruins. More terrible still was the human price with how some sixty million lost their lives because one man lost his soul.

In the end, the best words are those of Dwight D. Eisenhower, Supreme Commanding General of the Allied Expeditionary Force. Along with his fellow soldiers, the ruthless Georgy Zhukov who drew the line at Moscow, the admitted prima donna Douglas MacArthur who told the Japanese he would return, Bernard Montgomery who traded blow for blow with the Desert Fox in the sands of the Sahara, he did what was expected of him. And, on June 6th, 1944, on the eve of the greatest battle of all times, he did so saying:

Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen of the Allied Expeditionary Force!

You are about to embark of Great Crusade, towards which we have striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The hopes and prayers of liberty loving people everywhere march with you. […] Your task will not be an easy one. Our enemy is well trained, well equipped and battle hardened. He will fight savagely.

But this is the year 1944. […] The United Nations have inflicted upon the Germans great defeats, in open battle, man-to-man. […]I have full confidence, devotion to duty and skill in battle. We will accept nothing less that full Victory!

Good Luck! And let us all beseech the blessing of Almighty God upon the great and noble undertaking.

Life in this world may not be easy, sometimes it isn’t even fair, but its better, much better that what it would have been had the Axis powers won. Whether those old soldiers are your parents, your grandparents, or someone you may have read of only in a history book, please remember what they did for you and for the planet you live on. To paraphrase the words Admiral Nimitz spoke on the blood drenched battlefields of Iwo Jima, among they who fought the good fight, uncommon valor was a common virtue. Never forget that they saved your world, ever.

[state alchemist]

we must also remember that it was a war without heroes. we must also remember the atrocities committed on the german people. the overbombing by the americans even when it didn't serve any strategic purpose. the atrocities committed on east prussia and east germany by the soviets.

on related news putin has criticized the allies for dresden. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7749312/

[The Tocrowkian Reich]

One of my relatives was in WWII...but he was on the german side...does that count?

[Raptor]

Yes, it does. My grandfather fled his homeland because of the impending war. In a way, he also fought for what he believed in and no one ever faulted him for it. Arriving in America, he resumed his trade, provided for new customers and headed up a German-American social organization. Not a pacifist by any means, he applauded and encouraged his family members who later served in the U.S. military in defense of his new home.
His decision was an INDIVIDUAL choice, the best kind IMO.

[Pkmatrix]

I also had family members serve in WWII. My grandfather was on a ship during the Pacific War, and I believe he was at Okinawa. His brother was in North Africa, while my grandmother's brother fought at Normandy on D-Day. Her other brother was at Pearl Harbor on December 7. One of her brothers died in the war...I don't know if it was one of those two or a third that no one talks about.

I can't think about the Second World War and not think about Hiroshima or Nagasaki. What we did to the Japanese people was...unthinkable. I don't know if we truly comprehended the devastation we would wreak but...I do know that there aren't many people today who understand what happened. They hear about the cities, they hear about the bombs, but do they understand just how horrible it was? I really hope there is never another war like that ever again. I don't want to go through that, and I don't want any of my kids, grandkids, or further descendents to go through it either. Just...no.

[Dr. Strangelove]

They attacked us without declareing War, We were Neutral, And they attacked us. Consider the Nukeing, a bit more " Pay back " then anything.

[state alchemist]

They attacked us without declareing War, We were Neutral, And they attacked us. Consider the Nukeing, a bit more " Pay back " then anything.
lol, this so has flamebait written on it. :O

reason we nuked was to prevent the half a million losses in american life it would have taken to conquer mainland japan and win the war. after first nuke we gave japan option to surrender otherwise we drop a second. we all know their answer.

[Gojira2000]

My grandmother was born in Germany when the War broke in 1939. Her father and grandfather--my great & great-great grandfather--fought in the War (on the German side, of course). My Great-great grandfather died in battle *sniff*. But they won't Nazis, just so you know it.

But that was a terrible War. One that should NEVER be experince again (much less have been); but unfortunately, with the way this world is going, it doesn't seem long till WWIII starts, but here's hoping it won't.

I feel bad for saying this; but if it weren't for WWII it's very likely that we wouldn't have Godzilla... or maybe even kaiju eiga at all. Now, don't misunderstand me; I'm not thankful that WW2, or any other war for that matter, was fought; I'm just making an obbservation.

[Gojira2000]

reason we nuked was to prevent the half a million losses in american life it would have taken to conquer mainland japan
So we just nuke a half million Japanese instead? And that makes it right? No....

READ THIS:

I want it to be know that I do NOT take sides with certain people/gourps/nations in matters of war; for instance, it was horriable that the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, and it was horriable that America bombed Hiroshima and Nakasaki. War is horriable. Period.

I tell you this because I DO NOT want to start a cat-fight over this issue, of all issues, by my comment above about the nuking of Japan; but just thank about it for a moment. Now, I am NOT taking sides with NOR against America's (or anyone else's)actions. What happened is what happened.

[kent]

When you have relatives who took part in a war, you never forget it. Both of my grandfathers took part in WWII; in fact, they signed up. Sadly, one of my grandfathers has passed on and my other grandfather is in poor health. He did, however, talk about an incident he had in the Battle of the Bulge where his tank and another tank were cornered by several German Tiger tanks. Just as one of the Tigers was to hit his tank, he jump from his tank but got shrapnel (spelling?) in his leg. They were barely able to get out of there by radioing a rescue and putting an orange pontoon on the front of the other tank and a plane came and picked them up. We gave him a model of that very type of plane for Christmas several years ago and he bursted into tears saying, "That plane saved my life." He then told the story and everyone stopped what they were doing to listen to him. He remembers quite a bit but some events are a little fuzzy. He really does not like to talk about it, but isn't hesitant to do so if asked. My other grandfather, my mom tells me, didn't talk about the war much either. Even when he was married to my grandmother for the 40+ years they were together. Indeed, war does scare you and scar you mentally. You think you may have seen everything? All I can say you haven't seen anything until you have experienced war.

[Cole Deschain]

Both of my grandfathers served... both made it through to conceive my parents. My maternal grandfather (who mustanged his way up from a torpedo room grunt to skippering minesweepers by the end of the war) is still alive.

My paternal Grandfather (who was an Army lawyer and had the uneviable task of trying to get some justice for General Yamashita after the war) died quite recently... 2003, if I recall correctly.

My paternal Grandmother still remembers dancing with young S.S. officers when she vacationed in Germany before the war.

My great-uncle Teddy died at Guadalcanal, when his ship was blown in half by a Japabese Long Lance torpedo.

My great-uncle Taan was a Dutchman. When the Germans rolled into Amsterdam, he got into an... exchange with a Wehrmacht officer that left the German sorta... dead. Taan was in a concentration camp before his eyes cleared. Only the fact that he was a Dutchman, not some "untermensch," saved him from simply being gassed.

The war put my hometown (Fairbanks) on the map, as Simon B. Buckner funneled resources into Alaska once it became a theatre of operations (a Japanese diversion to some utterly worthless islands turned into a matter of pride).

Was it a "war without heroes"? No. Because none of them truly fail to dredge something heroic out of the general pile of <expletive deleted>. During the Japanese atrocities in Nanjing, Nazi party members present at the German embassy used their "allied" status to shield Chinese civilians to the best of their ability. Soviet soldiers answering to the orders of Josef "I'm at least as evil as Hitler is" Stalin did both great and horrible things. United States G.I.s were responsible for a very few verifiable atrocities, but they also rolled into Hitler's death-camps and saved what was left of the intended victims. Sergeant-Major Jacob Vouza, a colonial member of the British Empire at the start of the war, survived being clubbed with rifles and bayonets, including three wounds in the throat, crawled through Guadalcanal's jungles in the middle of a raging firefight to give his comrades a detailed description of the Japanese forces. He then passed out (but survived, in fact, the apply for U.S. citizenship after the war). Heroism is what you make of it. Feel free to condemn policy, but leave the poor *******s on the ground out of it.

And let me just further say that I'm apalled at the simplicity of some of the viewpoints I've heard expressed here so far. To engage in trivial moralizing or finger-pointing is to miss the actual importance of the Second World War.

[state alchemist]

So we just nuke a half million Japanese instead? And that makes it right? No....

210,000 japanese died from both a-bomb attacks. not half a million.

and the half a million americans it would have taken to conquer japan is just the estimate of american dead it would have taken. the cost of japanese dead for protecting the mainland is estimated at 2million+. the a-bombs actually saved many lives in what would have been a ferocious city to city, street by street war for the mainland.Was it a "war without heroes"? No. Because none of them truly fail to dredge something heroic out of the general pile of <expletive deleted>. During the Japanese atrocities in Nanjing, Nazi party members present at the German embassy used their "allied" status to shield Chinese civilians to the best of their ability. Soviet soldiers answering to the orders of Josef "I'm at least as evil as Hitler is" Stalin did both great and horrible things. United States G.I.s were responsible for a very few verifiable atrocities, but they also rolled into Hitler's death-camps and saved what was left of the intended victims. Sergeant-Major Jacob Vouza, a colonial member of the British Empire at the start of the war, survived being clubbed with rifles and bayonets, including three wounds in the throat, crawled through Guadalcanal's jungles in the middle of a raging firefight to give his comrades a detailed description of the Japanese forces. He then passed out (but survived, in fact, the apply for U.S. citizenship after the war). Heroism is what you make of it. Feel free to condemn policy, but leave the poor *******s on the ground out of it.

And let me just further say that I'm apalled at the simplicity of some of the viewpoints I've heard expressed here so far. To engage in trivial moralizing or finger-pointing is to miss the actual importance of the Second World War.my comment wasn't meant at the common soldiers. i never said that. it was aimed at the nations that proclaim themselves as the heroes of ww2.

[Evil alla Pure]

Some of my ancestors went through the Holocaust. I don't know very much about them but my mom went to Washington D.C. and typed her family name in one of the computers there. It turns out I'm part Jewish. Whether they made it or even went to a death-camp I don't know. It makes you think more when you know that people in your own family line were persecuted so and, it sheds new light on racism and prejudice. They weren't, of course, the brave Allied soldiers that fought in the war but I find them and all the Jews that went through that Hell heros in their own right. Sorry if that was a bit off topic but I thought I would share that small information.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Kent, Your Grandfather is one of luckiest men alive. A Tiger Tank, hurls a 40-70lb Shell, at nearly a mile-a-minute. A Sherman would be hit, and exsplode nearly on contact. The shell just needed to SCAVE the tank, and it would kill it. Your lucky your GrandFather didn't go aginst the most powerful Tank in the war: The 80 Ton King Tiger.

[Kaiser Kronos]

My Uncle Otway served in the Battle of the Bulge, and I still regret never having known him that well. Rest in Peace, all the dead of the Greatest War. This war did have heroes, but it also had villains. Let us never forget that.

[Saruman]

When you have relatives who took part in a war, you never forget it. Both of my grandfathers took part in WWII; in fact, they signed up. Sadly, one of my grandfathers has passed on and my other grandfather is in poor health. He did, however, talk about an incident he had in the Battle of the Bulge where his tank and another tank were cornered by several German Tiger tanks. Just as one of the Tigers was to hit his tank, he jump from his tank but got shrapnel (spelling?) in his leg. They were barely able to get out of there by radioing a rescue and putting an orange pontoon on the front of the other tank and a plane came and picked them up. We gave him a model of that very type of plane for Christmas several years ago and he bursted into tears saying, "That plane saved my life." He then told the story and everyone stopped what they were doing to listen to him. He remembers quite a bit but some events are a little fuzzy. He really does not like to talk about it, but isn't hesitant to do so if asked. My other grandfather, my mom tells me, didn't talk about the war much either. Even when he was married to my grandmother for the 40+ years they were together. Indeed, war does scare you and scar you mentally. You think you may have seen everything? All I can say you haven't seen anything until you have experienced war.

That's the really odd thing about the people who fought in WWII compared to other wars, they never really talk about it unless asked. My father fought in WWII, his company was the first one to go in on Omaha Beach. Luckily he survived that, though he came home with 80mm shell fragments in his shin. most of which were never removed because they were so close to major veins. In all my time growing up he almost never talked about the war. I actually found out more information, when he passed away last year, because I made a memorial display of all his medals and pins for my mother, than he had really ever told me himself. It's just something I find odd because you see so many people talk about Vietnam and other wars/conflicts but not WWII.

[KAMERUS88]

My Great Grand father was a Gunner on a SHip, Never met him though, My Grandfather on the other side was a Mechanic for a naval ship, they were both in the Pacific Conflict.

[Solar_Behemoth]

My Grandpa, who's still alive today and I see him very often (live pretty close), was in the navy during WWII. He went to Pearl Harbor right after the infamous attack to repair/clean up the aftermath. He says he vividly remembers the nightmarish sights of human limbs drifting in the water...

[The Tocrowkian Reich]

we must also remember that it was a war without heroes. we must also remember the atrocities committed on the german people. the overbombing by the americans even when it didn't serve any strategic purpose. the atrocities committed on east prussia and east germany by the soviets.

on related news putin has criticized the allies for dresden. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7749312/

A bit to late for that. But yes, I agree. Dresden was horrible. The people that ordered it should have been hanged alongside alot of those nazi's.

[Gorjirus]

Both my of my grandfathers served in World War II. My moother's father served as a mechanic on the warplanes, while my father's father seved in the Alaska National Guard. Both of them survived, though both are now dead. NOt a day goes by that I don't see a reminder of them, from my paternal's grandfather's honorary American Flag (as he also served in World War I), and my maternal grandfather's war trunk.

I salute those who fought to protect my freedom.

[Shadow]

My Grandfather (on my father's side) fought in WWII with the Allies. He was involved in a battle at the Rhine, and was injured when he had his elbow blown off by a bullet. While lying in the hospital ward, a Colonel came through and layed a Purple Heart medal at the foot of his bed (and the other injured soldiers also) and saluted them. He said a few words and then left. Shortly there after, a subordinate of the Colonel (possibly a Captain) came through and gathered the medals from all the soldiers and put them in a box. My grandfather's commanding officer never completed the paper work for the Purple Heart (along with many of the other injureds paperwork) so there is not a lot of records for this. I assume that the Colonel continued this through the rest of the wards. At any rate, my Grandfather was injured and has no Purple Heart to show for it, and cannot continue the fight as he died in 1991 (while I was still fairly young). My father has been (for as long as I can remember) trying to get the Medal which my Grandfather deserves. There is more to this (I believe), and I will (possibly) tell more after I speak to my Father on the matter.

MORE:

My grandfather will probably never get his medal for it is tied up in too much red tape. The Review Board wants more information, and my Father keeps running into dead-ends. They actually asked him to try to locate members of Grandpa's unit (the possibility of finding a live member is extremly low, and by now they are probably all deceased). Because of the big fire in St. Louis (where the records were held), many of the Governments military (WWI, WWII, Korea, and Vietnam) records were destroyed. So, with no more available information or evidence, he will possibly never get the award he deserves.

[Dr. Strangelove]

My grandfather faught on the Soviet Side in WW2( Family left the Soviet Union while the war was begining ). He was fighting both With, and Aginst the germans, He died in 1981, And was burried in Moscow.

[Saruman]

My Grandfather (on my father's side) fought in WWII with the Allies. He was involved in a battle at the Rhine, and was injured when he had his elbow blown off by a bullet. While lying in the hospital ward, a Colonel came through and layed a Purple Heart medal at the foot of his bed (and the other injured soldiers also) and saluted them. He said a few words and then left. Shortly there after, a subordinate of the Colonel (possibly a Captain) came through and gathered the medals from all the soldiers and put them in a box. My grandfather's commanding officer never completed the paper work for the Purple Heart (along with many of the other injureds paperwork) so there is not a lot of records for this. I assume that the Colonel continued this through the rest of the wards. At any rate, my Grandfather was injured and has no Purple Heart to show for it, and cannot continue the fight as he died in 1991 (while I was still fairly young). My father has been (for as long as I can remember) trying to get the Medal which my Grandfather deserves. There is more to this (I believe), and I will (possibly) tell more after I speak to my Father on the matter.

MORE:

My grandfather will probably never get his medal for it is tied up in too much red tape. The Review Board wants more information, and my Father keeps running into dead-ends. They actually asked him to try to locate members of Grandpa's unit (the possibility of finding a live member is extremly low, and by now they are probably all deceased). Because of the big fire in St. Louis (where the records were held), many of the Governments military (WWI, WWII, Korea, and Vietnam) records were destroyed. So, with no more available information or evidence, he will possibly never get the award he deserves.

Shadow, your family doesn't have ANY of his paperwork? You should be able to get a complete set of his military paperwork, like his discharge papers and such. I assume that he was discharged after he was injured, which should mean he was discharged for injuries suffered in combat, and that should be on record. I got alot of my fathers paperwork after he died, it was through his paperwork that I now actually know tons more about what he did in the military during WWII, stuff that he never once told me or my brother & sister. I never knew my dad was a MP or that he was able to operate every infantry weapon they had, including all trucks and tanks. My father also had alot more medals awarded to him then he actually had in his posession and I was able to purchase the missing medals, bars and ribbons for the display I put together for my mom. The paperwork is so crucial in determining just what a person should have received, and I can't believe that there isn't a record of something about your Grandfather someplace, whether in your familys posession or in the militarys posession. It's for stuff like this that you should be going through every box in your attic and checking every piece of paper you find.

I do hope that your family gets the medal that your Grandfather deserved.

Oh, here's a quick question do you have a VA Hospital in your area and did your Grandfather use it, they may have some records that would be helpful to you.

Again good luck with it, and don't stop trying to get it, its really worth the fight and effort. My dad's purple heart is the one thing that I have always wanted and it means alot to me that he got one.

[Raptor]

The war put my hometown (Fairbanks) on the map, as Simon B. Buckner funneled resources into Alaska once it became a theatre of operations (a Japanese diversion to some utterly worthless islands turned into a matter of pride).Check out "The Thousand-Mile War", Brian Garfield's 1969 book on WW II in Alaska and the Aleutians. Remember the Cuban missile crisis and 90 miles was too close for comfort? You can look at Alaska and the Aleutians the same way; stepping stones that for 15 months were the location of one of the least known yet toughest fought campaigns of WW II. If the Japanese took Alaska, it would only be three hours before their planes could attack the big Boeing bomber plant in Seattle and the Puget Sound naval ship yards at Bremerton. Geography time, folks...
Was it a "war without heroes"? No. Because none of them truly fail to dredge something heroic out of the general pile of <expletive deleted>.Exactly. Those defenders gave the U.S. its first theater-wide victory over Japan and ended its hopes of victory before the U.S. could recover from Pearl Harbor, according to the author. I highly recommend this book to Alaskans and those in the Lower 48 who tend to think of this great state as remote, isolated, wild, wooly or whatever. I was up there during the "Cold War" myself and fighter pilots out of Elmendorf AFB (Anchorage) would eyeball their Russian equivalents while on patrol. "Bear in the air" had an entirely different meaning than it does now.
The attack on Pearl Harbor is chronicled thusly: Fairbanks radio station KFAR picks up a faint signal with their powerful equipment at 9:30 AM and the announcer calls General Buckner at Fort Richardson (army base in Anchorage). Alaska could well be the next target. The guns at Fort Rich are fired to summon the soldiers to arms and radio stations broadcast the news of the attack to the the territory. Gov. Gruening and Buckner outline emergency plans which the General already had thought out for just such an event. When Buchner orders the civilian radio stations off the air to clear for military traffic, Canada thinks Alaska has been taken by the Japanese and makes announcements to that effect! Isolated Alaskans pick them up and the alarm is compounded by Radio Tokyo (the short wave Japanese effort, NOT Jay Johnson!) boasting of having bombed the dickens out of Kodiak and Dutch Harbor, 3,000 people being killed in air attacks on Fairbanks and Anchorage and Sitka are now under Japanese control.
You will need a map to follow what we're talking about here but think about it: As far south as Puget Sound, farmers grabbed their shot guns to patrol the beaches while in Seattle, there was mob panic looting. San Francisco blacked out the town. Were 30 Japanese planes turned back at the Golden Gate Bridge? Brig. Gen. Ryan claimed so.
Back in Alaska, the entire air force of six obsolete medium bombers and 12 outdated pursuit planes went airborne to avoid the fate of the ships at Pearl, despite a severe lack of fuel. The President called an emergency meeting of Congress and belated orders were cut to get aid on the way.
48 hours after the attack, the jittery Air Warning Service sent out an alarm, two B-18s almost collided in the fog and three fighters shot down a weather balloon. After that little sortee, they had to follow the railroad tracks at tree-top level to find their way back to Anchorage due to the fog. The LA TIMES headline: JAPANESE AIR STRIKES ON ALASKA.
The Navy also got its licks in: their planes bombed a whale at Sitka, mistaking it for a sub. On a lighter side, the ANCHORAGE TIMES suggested Buchner camoflage Mount Denali (McKinley), the tallest peak in North America.
Enterprising missionaries had already signed up confused natives as conscientious objectors before Draft Board officials parachuted into their remote villages while back country sourdoughs organized vigilante squads. 230 Japanese residents were also interned in Alaska, more than half of them being native born. Several Bundist groups in Alaska were arrested, along with some White Russian exiles suspected of being Nazi collaborators. A small spy organization was uncovered that took its orders from Hitler's one time adjutant who was on loan to the Japanese intelligence command. No further intelligence of Alaskan defenses reached Japan after that.
Be it known that Japanese subs were off the Alaskan and Canadian shores, no doubt scouting for landing sites. Kiska and Attu were occupied. This provided Tojo good news to tell the Japanese people instead of about Yamamoto's debacle at Midway. As well, occupying Alaska would be a good defense for Japan itself against Doolittle type raids.
There was even a PBY Blitzkreig: on Kiska. Within three days, many of these "flying hippos" would be destroyed, along with aging Catalinas. Run out of fuel, ammo and bombs up there, what are you gonna do? Eleven days into the campaign, the western 1,000 miles of the Aleutian chain was devoid of American forces and the Japanese occupied American territory. Villagers burned their towns before being evacuated.
I don't care what anyone has seen as far as travelogues and touristy Alaska stuff goes. You want to really understand war at its worst, read about the conditions this campaign took place in, the logistics involved as well as the bureauocracy. FEAR forced the choice of these particular battlegrounds.
Heroism is what you make of it. Feel free to condemn policy, but leave the poor *******s on the ground out of it. Note the news black-outs that often accompanied wartime action compared to the "media circus" that was Iraq. War can be fought on many fronts, from our backyard to New York City, as 9/11 proved. In these instances, they brought it to us.

And let me just further say that I'm apalled at the simplicity of some of the viewpoints I've heard expressed here so far. To engage in trivial moralizing or finger-pointing is to miss the actual importance of the Second World War.Please clarify. If some of our comments are restrained, I'm guessing it's in reverence for those who were involved in the war but are no longer with us. Mention was made of participants not speaking of their experiences. I've found that to be true also but can understand why one would not want to expose others to certain horrors they might have witnessed or endured. It can be a tough call sometimes.

[Cole Deschain]

Check out "The Thousand-Mile War", Brian Garfield's 1969 book on WW II in Alaska and the Aleutians.

An utterly awesome book. Also, a good look at a theatre of operations many regarded as a total waste of time.

His newest edition has fixed a few existing errors, too...

Please clarify. If some of our comments are restrained, I'm guessing it's in reverence for those who were involved in the war but are no longer with us.

Restraint, I can handle. Shrill accusations and finger-pointing that do not have any substantiating claims I cannot.

[Shadow]

My father says:

We have records of him being at the battle at the Ryan River in Europe, and we have the record of him being in a hospital, but we don't have the paperwork of the captain that awards him the purple heart, since the captain failed to complete the records. Without that record, we cannot get him the award. My father has appealed to the board, and went up as high as the Army Board for Correction of Military Records, and they denied him, and went as far as to say that the decision was final, unless more relevant information was brought to light. Because of the fire in '73 at the National Personnel Records Center, any of the information that could have possibly helped is now lost.

I thank you for your concern Saruman, but it looks very bleak in getting the award for him. With no other information (other than what was already sent in), we can't refile for a new hearing. Perhaps one day a new lead will open up...

[Raptor]

Shadow: There should be other options available to get the necessary information. Your U.S. senators and representatives might also be of assistance, as well as locating where his unit's historical records are kept. The paperback book I mentioned to Cole has an extensive reference section about this.
Maybe something as simple as a dogpile.com search would yield additional paths to check out, especially by unit designation. Collaboration by his fellow squad members (or details found in their memoirs) might be another option, as well as the American Legion and other service organizations. Even with the fire in St. Louis, the military is notoroious for its amount of paperwork so I'm hoping a "trail", even from so long ago, can be re-established. :thumbs:

[Shadow]

Shadow: There should be other options available to get the necessary information. Your U.S. senators and representatives might also be of assistance, as well as locating where his unit's historical records are kept. The paperback book I mentioned to Cole has an extensive reference section about this.
Maybe something as simple as a dogpile.com search would yield additional paths to check out, especially by unit designation. Collaboration by his fellow squad members (or details found in their memoirs) might be another option, as well as the American Legion and other service organizations. Even with the fire in St. Louis, the military is notoroious for its amount of paperwork so I'm hoping a "trail", even from so long ago, can be re-established. :thumbs:
Perhaps my father will try that, but there will have to be something drastically different from what has already been sent in by my father. The main reason that it was denied was because there were no records of him being given treatment in a field hospital, mostly because:

A) the commanding officer failed to complete the paper work.
or
B) the records were lost n the fire that I've mentioned before.

Thank you for your concern Raptor, as i've said before, maybe something, someday, will turn up.

[Pug Puppy]

When I think of the heroes of WWII, I think of the Allied and German medics both who tried to save folk's lives; even the enemies.

I think of Japanese camp guards, who were Christians, who smuggled food and hygiene items into the death camps of the Pacific.

I think of the Russian town that tried to save Jews from the Holocaust by baptizing them.

I think of the OSS and FBI agents who parachuted behind Japnese and Nazi lines.

I think of the soldiers on both sides who fought honorably.: George Patton,
Bernard Montgomery, Erwin Rommel, Felix Barkmann, Audie Murphy(among others).

I think of Corporal Smoky, the rescued Yorkie who entertained Allied wounded.

[Orga777]

Indeed. Waiting until nigh-the-end of both conflicts before intervening..

Makes winning easier, really.

I will give you WWI, but we joined WWII in 1941 and the war ended in 1945. We were there for a good amount of time Doc and we were just better than the Germans were who still couldn't get over and finish off England. :p

[Dr. Strangelove]

I will give you WWI, but we joined WWII in 1941 and the war ended in 1945. We were there for a good amount of time Doc and we were just better than the Germans were who still couldn't get over and finish off England. :p

...

We joined the war in 1942. December 7th 1941 isn't "1941". We had no troops..anywhere, short of the Philippines, until 1942. The war had basically been over by that point. (the invasion of the Soviet Union was already being turned around, it was only a matter of time).

[Seer235]

Don't give him WWI, Orga. We may have joined near the end of the war, but that's just cause we kicked those German's right out of France. Paris would have been taken had we not intervened. Then France would have fallen, and Britain would have said "screw it." It was the USA that won the war for the allies.

[Cole Deschain]

Mmm-hmm.

See the World War I thread for exactly why that's a load of hooey.

[Godzilla]

This war was soooo 60+ years ago. Get with the times people! We need a War World III thread!

[Orga777]

...

We joined the war in 1942. December 7th 1941 isn't "1941". We had no troops..anywhere, short of the Philippines, until 1942. The war had basically been over by that point. (the invasion of the Soviet Union was already being turned around, it was only a matter of time).

You are just mad that the USA kicked the crap out of German Panzer tanks with a bunch of scrappy ol' Sherman tanks. :p

[Kaiser Kronos]

You are just mad that the USA kicked the crap out of German Panzer tanks with a bunch of scrappy ol' Sherman tanks. :p

I'd say the Red Army and T-34s had a lot more to do with it, along with Moscow's fighting 3/4 of the entire Wehrmacht and still winning when the US and UK both struggled against the dregs, but what do I know? :look:

[Zardac the Great]

Okay...first off, any of you who have relatives who fought in the war, PLEASE INTERVIEW THEM WITH A TAPE RECORDER ON!

You may well soon be glad you did. And as a History student, I always approve of recording history.

As to Hiroshima and Nagasaki...I will defend Truman's decision to the last.

There is much to be said about this war. I would contest the assertion that there were no heroes in the war, but that may come tomorrow. It is midnight and I did not intend to still be awake.

I will end this by saying that I do agree with Juan, and I would like to salute those who fought for my freedom, and for those who still fight for my freedom. God Bless You, and thank you for all you've done.

[SuperXAsh]

Both my grandfathers served, one in the navy, the other in the air force, they just never saw much combat at all, miraculously.