Anguirus...

[ALLOSAURZ]

Most people on here know my theories of Anguirus surviving GRA and him having near instant regeneration so I will only list a brief outline.
A. Why he survived GRA
    1. He was still moving after falling over the cliff.
    2.Godzillas radioactive fire only ignited his shell nothing vital
    3.He was on fire next to water. How hard is it to move a few feet into the water?
    4.They never said he was killed on film just defeated. Saying he was killed would have eased the publics mind a bit more instead of that he was just defeated and fleeing.
    5.No veretebrate creature has been killed by Godzilla's atomic breath in the series. Even the ones with fur.
B. Why his behavior wotwards Godzilla changed
    1.He was put in his place. He realised Godzilla was the stronger creature so he figured it would have been best to serve him rather than be killed by him.
    2. Also I believe they were fighting over a dominance issue since those two were the largest dinosaurs in the showa series. Wolves fight for positions in the pack. Once the the Alpha male has been picked the pack becomes closer than ever. Anguirus and godzilla were both dinosaurs. Ever notice how none of the other saurian kaiju such as Gorosaurus, baragon, and varan ever fought godzilla? They were no where close to Godzilla's size so they recognized him as the dominate creature. The only exception to this is Rodan. But Pterodactyls aren't dinosaurs so i can see why they would continue fighting even though Rodan was handing Godzilla his ***. The two eventuallyset aside differences after being forced together to fight KG and my guess is they both realised there is room enough for the two of them.
C. Anguirus's Regeneration
   1.IMO he survived GRA
   2.In DAM he took a fall that should have crushed his back and was jumped on by KG but he apparently looked unharmed.
    3.In Godzilla vs Gigan he runs into Gigans buzzsaw. We clearly see blood. For the rest of the movie there is no wound
   4.Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla he gets his jaw broken. IMO Bone takes longer to heal so that explains why his voice sounded damaged. The blood however apparently stopped pooring out of the wound so it mst have clotted unnaturally fast. It also makes since that his regeneration would be slower as he looked aged. His tusks had fallen out and it looked like he was suffereing from a case of cataracts as his eyes were glossy. So IMO if he were aged a bit it makes since that his regenerative skills would have slowed down to as elederly people have a more difficult times healing from injuries and sickness than younger people.

So there you go, in a nutshell those are my theories on my favorite kaiju Anguirus

[anguirus55]

Most interesting indeed...I think the "aged" thing may be reading a bit too much into it though.  Even regeneration doesn't instantly heal truly grievous wounds.

[Aragorn_Strider22]

<font color='#008080'>I agree with your theory. Anguirus must have really good regeneration or else he wouldn't have been able to survive a lot of the hits he has taken over the years.

[ALLOSAURZ]

Hmm I still think they aging had something to do with his woungs in g vs MG because he did look older but yes having your jaw broken and your tongue almost ripped out would certainly take longer to heal. Although I just blame most of it on bad editingI still believe Anguirus has uber regenerative powers. However I still believe the Anguirus in DAM was a second ANguirus because it takes place in 1999. In GvsMG Anguirus looked aged while in DAM he looked umm how do I say this ...peppy as in full of pep? Bah you know what I mean.

[Godzilla2004]

Another thing. &nbsp;In GRA they say Ang. hates the more warlike dinosaurs. &nbsp;In other words, he was a good guy from the start and sided with Goji when he turned hero on us. &nbsp;So with Ang it's not a dominance issue, it's a morals issue &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[Aragorn_Strider22]

<font color='#008080'>Wait a sec, didn't GvsMechagodzilla take place AFTER DAM?

That might be why Angillas seemed weaker in the battle against Mechagodzilla, he was still recovering from the hits he took from Ghidorah.

[ALLOSAURZ]

DAM took place in 1999 though. G vs MG took place in 1974

[Aragorn_Strider22]

<font color='#008080'>??? Where does it say that in the movie.

[baragon2005]

Quote[/b] (Aragorn_Strider22 @ June 05 2003,09:39)]??? Where does it say that in the movie.
Toho's &quot;official (if you can call it that)&quot; timeline (which I found somewhere- don't know if it is or not) says that DAM was suppossed to be the last Godzilla film, so it makes since if it still is in the Showa timeline.






http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/baragonsmilie.gif

[Mirren]

Wow, that's cool dude. I totally agree, nice work.

Quote[/b] ]He was put in his place. He realised Godzilla was the stronger creature so he figured it would have been best to serve him rather than be killed by him

One thing. When has Angorous ever surrendered in a fight?

[Giganzilla]

Quote[/b] (baragon2003 @ June 05 2003,10:59)]Quote[/b] (Aragorn_Strider22 @ June 05 2003,09:39)]??? Where does it say that in the movie.
Toho's &quot;official (if you can call it that)&quot; timeline (which I found somewhere- don't know if it is or not) says that DAM was suppossed to be the last Godzilla film, so it makes since if it still is in the Showa timeline.






http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/baragonsmilie.gif
Then again, Terror of Mechagodzilla sorta contradicts this, as it refers to the events of DAM being in the past (as if the timeline sticks with the order of the movies). &nbsp;Probably a mistake on that movies part, but still...

[Kaiju Nexus]

never . . . except for when he fought MechaGodzilla . . .

[Hybrid Gojira]

Quote[/b] (Godzilla2004 @ June 04 2003,23:52)]Another thing. *In GRA they say Ang. hates the more warlike dinosaurs. *In other words, he was a good guy from the start and sided with Goji when he turned hero on us. *So with Ang it's not a dominance issue, it's a morals issue *http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
You did get that from the dub, correct? If I am not mistaken, that was just some bull that the dubbers (someone) made up. I haven't watched the original in sometime, but I believe that dialogue is not present.

[Denton Van Zan]

Godzilla, Rodan, and Anguirus are species of dinosaurs.
When one gets offed, another eventually hatches out.

[Tokyo VigilanteX]

<font color='#810541'>I think &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/anguirussmilie.gif &nbsp;would be a omnivore,him being a mutated whatcha'masaurus(can't spell the name) was a herbavore,then maybe &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/anguirussmilie.gif &nbsp;is a omnivore...

But if you think other wise........

[Daikaijuking]

But why would he be an Omnivore? I don't get that. I think he would stay a herbivore, and it has it's sharp teeth for fighting.

[ALLOSAURZ]

Quote[/b] (Hybrid Gojira @ Dec. 08 2003,02:08)]Quote[/b] (Godzilla2004 @ June 04 2003,23:52)]Another thing. *In GRA they say Ang. hates the more warlike dinosaurs. *In other words, he was a good guy from the start and sided with Goji when he turned hero on us. *So with Ang it's not a dominance issue, it's a morals issue *http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
You did get that from the dub, correct? If I am not mistaken, that was just some bull that the dubbers (someone) made up. I haven't watched the original in sometime, but I believe that dialogue is not present.
No that was also in the sub so it's cannon

[Project Pimp]

Anguirus clearly was killed by Godzilla. You don't get your neck torn open, lit on fire, and wake up the next day, folks. Most likely, the Anguirus which appeared in DAM (or technically Gigan according to the timeline) is just another creature. After all, if Godzilla can die and be replaced by another, I certainly don't see why Anguirus cannot!

[Saruman]

People are also overlooking the differences between Ang from GRA and the rest of the Showa Series.

Such as the division of the carapace, in GRA its split down the middle, all other Angs dont have this.

The carapace in GRA is also &quot;loose,&quot; it just flops around on his back like a cape, in the rest of the Showa series, this doesnt happen as the carapace is clearly attached to the rest of the body.

Just something to consider.

[Husnock]

A creature's teeth are evolved towards eating the food they live on, not fighting other creatures (unless, of course, they're a carnivore). &nbsp;It was stated in Gigantis/G Raids Again that the Angilas as a species were &quot;murderous brutes,&quot; which would imply they were bloodthirsty predators, so it's likely that Angilas was a car-/omnivore.

[Halomek]

Given that Angilas doesn't have any teeth suited for munching on vegetation, I'd say its safe to say he's a carnivore.

Then again, Toho suits in those days have never been known to be all that accurate. &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[SuperXAsh]

Yeah also I wouldn't have sided with the person who ripped my neck open and lit me on fire (It'd be like siding with the man who burned down your house, broke your leg and shot your dog/cat). So I agree with the others on the &quot;It's another Anguirus&quot; theory. It happened to Rodan also... didn't it? *has totally forgotten*

http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/kinggojismilie.gif &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/gamerasmilie.gif &nbsp;http://www.rodansroost.com/ikonboard/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/kingkongsmilie.gif

[anguirus55]

Quote[/b] ]never . . . except for when he fought MechaGodzilla . . .

Retreat doesn't equal surrender.

Quote[/b] ]The carapace in GRA is also &quot;loose,&quot; it just flops around on his back like a cape, in the rest of the Showa series, this doesnt happen as the carapace is clearly attached to the rest of the body.


I am almost positive that that is just the maquette that was matted into publicity material. &nbsp;I looked for that in the film itself and I never saw it.

Quote[/b] ]Anguirus clearly was killed by Godzilla. You don't get your neck torn open, lit on fire, and wake up the next day, folks. Most likely, the Anguirus which appeared in DAM (or technically Gigan according to the timeline) is just another creature. After all, if Godzilla can die and be replaced by another, I certainly don't see why Anguirus cannot!


Unless, like ALLO says, he regenerated.

[Angiru-San]

<font color='#FF7F00'>I think In the Kaijuology department nowadays we should start to concider old Ang as a new species....if you look at Angilas and an ankylosaurin a picture its very hard to find a resemblence....examples:

Angilas' Carcauss sticks up off his back slightly and is covered with many erect spikes...while the ankylosaurs had bony outgrowths from an overgrowth on their back hide...not a seperate shell like carcauss on the top...with almost flat spikes

ANgilas has no club on his tail, beak on his mouth, or teeth suitable for being a herbivore like the ankylosaur

ANgilas sports a barbed tail and &nbsp;a large crown of horns on its back-skull area...VERY unlike an ankylosaur....

it also has clawed seperate toes on its feet...where as the ankylosaurs has more like elephant type clawed feet....

shall i go on??

So i htink its safe to say that NO mutation can do THAT much to an ankylosaur....so...I believe he should be regarded as a new species....an Angilasaur maybe!


hmm....Angilasaur....sounds good!

[Angiru-San]

<font color='#FF7F00'>I posted this in a previous post.... here it is:

&quot;I think In the Kaijuology department nowadays we should start to concider old Ang as a new species....if you look at Angilas and an ankylosaurin a picture its very hard to find a resemblence....examples:

Angilas' Carcauss sticks up off his back slightly and is covered with many erect spikes...while the ankylosaurs had bony outgrowths from an overgrowth on their back hide...not a seperate shell like carcauss on the top...with almost flat spikes

ANgilas has no club on his tail, beak on his mouth, or teeth suitable for being a herbivore like the ankylosaur

ANgilas sports a barbed tail and &nbsp;a large crown of horns on its back-skull area...VERY unlike an ankylosaur....

it also has clawed seperate toes on its feet...where as the ankylosaurs has more like elephant type clawed feet....

shall i go on??

So i htink its safe to say that NO mutation can do THAT much to an ankylosaur....so...I believe he should be regarded as a new species....an Angilasaur maybe!


hmm....Angilasaur....sounds good!&quot;

Yes! So I think thats enought to become evident that Angilas is no ankylosaur...so I propose a new species being entered into the realm of Kaijuology...the Angilasaur! Its most famous member....none other than ANgilas!

SO...add some theorys and stuff if ya wanna!

[Baryonyx13]

<font color='#000080'>I agree. I have long thought that his relation to anklyosaurs was simply an excuse to make him fit in with the Godzilla being a T-rex like mutation. I see no real resemblence. He is a new or undiscovered species.

Although, I'd call it an Anguirasaur. http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/dozingoff.gif



http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/anguirussmilie.gif

[watercyborg 1966]

Angilas a new species? That's a safe bet I would say.

There again with respect to the Ankylosaurus, you have to remember that those are only artist renditions and that the real creature may have looked different.

Angilas could be a relative of the Ankylosaurus, the same way that a crocodile and a cayman are similar in appearance (only the cayman has a longer snout.) &nbsp;So perhaps Angy' and Anky are cousins, if not the same thing.

[watercyborg 1966]

See my reply to &quot;Anguirus&quot; in the &quot;Research Projects&quot; forum.

[Baryonyx13]

<font color='#000080'>I can't think of an predators that are directly related to any herbivores.



http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/anguirussmilie.gif

[Angiru-San]

<font color='#FF7F00'>there are but in some very rare instances...and more oftenly its a carnivore or herbivore being related to a omnivore...which ang could be...but very few dinosaurs were, so he could be a distant cousin of the ankylosaur if he is an omnivore, but Id go with the safe bet of the carnivore, just look at those fangs!

so I still say vote him in as a new species

[watercyborg 1966]

The only thing that made me think of Angilas as having a
shell is because I had actually read somewhere once, a theory that speculated that reptiles with a carapace eventually developed shells as evolution dictated the need for stronger, more integrated defense mechanisms, so a shell became a more efficient way to defend against attack. Thus his relation to the Ankylosaur and other related products of evolution. And yeah , those ARE some set of fangs old Angy has! I would NOT want to be his dentist. &nbsp;http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[Saruman]

Quote[/b] (Halomek @ Jan. 15 2004,22:31)]Then again, Toho suits in those days have never been known to be all that accurate. *http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What about this day? Baby G had some nice fangs on him and he was eating roses.

[Gigan III]

Quote[/b] (Saruman @ April 01 2004,18:18)]Quote[/b] (Halomek @ Jan. 15 2004,22:31)]Then again, Toho suits in those days have never been known to be all that accurate. *http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What about this day? Baby G had some nice fangs on him and he was eating roses.
<font color='#FF0000'>Well, a dog is a carnovour but when it has a stomach ache it eats grass.

[Saruman]

^^

But there is a reason for that, as you said, it’s when they don’t feel well. Baby G was just hatched and he was eating roses. Sorry, but even for a Kaiju that just doesn’t seem normal. But then you also have to ask the question, was the Godzillasaur a herbivore? It’s pretty hard to imagine a creature that size living on a small island and being able to survive if it’s a carnivore. Chances are it’s an omnivore that has more herbivore tendencies, it also wasn’t very aggressive, if it was a carnivore it would have attacked the soldiers as a food source.

[RexRaptor]

Well, i guess its time for me to clear this up. Angilas is a anklyosaur. He evolved from this:


EUOPLOCEPHALUS
(True plated or well armoured head)
FAMILY: Ankylosauridae.
ERA: Late Cretaceous (Campanian - Maastrichtian 83.5 - 65 Ma).
SIZE: 6 - 7 m (20 - 24 ft).
LOCATION: North America.
FOSSILS: 40 specimens, 15 complete or partial skulls, teeth, 1 skeleton with armour.
COMMENTS: Weighed up to 3 tons. This ancestor of Ankylosaurus had no spines on its sides but bands of bony plates across its back and tail with small bony studs between the bands. Plates jutted up over its shoulder and back, and it may have had floating armour in the skin, or a horny sheath. Unlike most ankylosaurs it had a light skull with looped air passages to warm air before it reached the lungs, and bony shutters to protect the eyes. It was the most common North American ankylosaur.
SPECIES LIST:

E. tutus Lambe, 1902/1910 (type), senior synonym of Stereocephalus tutus and includes Palaeoscincus asper, P. tutus, Dyloplosaurus acutosquameus, Scolosaurus cutleri, Ankylosaurus acinacodens, A. tutus and Anodontosaurus lambei.
E. giganteus Maleev, 1956/Coombs, 1971 is included with Tarchia gigantea.
E. magniventris Brown, 1908 is included with Ankylosaurus magniventris.

Now, can we put this to rest?

[Angiru-San]

<font color='#FF7F00'>put this to rest...no offense at all budd but yuove only posted 4 times...which means your new...so i dont think its been somethin thats been botheren you....and is that official...ofcourse not! because it states that no where in G Raids Again, or anywhere OFICCIALY by TOHO...so id haft to agree, and most of us would concider him a new species


but other than that! Welcome to the Kaiju Phile Forums!

[Tokyo VigilanteX]

Hmmmmmm
I agree with Anglias.Also supporting your no mutant theroy is that Ang has no long range weapons of any kind.

[Alien-G]

no one ever said he was a mutant

[Mechasoukougeki2]

Angilas is right, Anguirus looks like he definitely wasn't mutated, maybe an Angilasaur was still effected by the atomic bomb but grew to gigantic proportions

[Darth Reaper]

If an Anguirusaurus grew to that size due to exposure to nuclear radiation, I believe that would still make him a mutation. &nbsp;After all, no natural land animal would grow that large, it would be crushed by its own weight. &nbsp;Anguirus is unnaturally large, therefore he must be an unnatural creature.

So, I'd say that Anguirus is a mutation, just not a mutant ankylosaurs. &nbsp;He's a mutant Anguirusaurus. &nbsp;http://www.kaijuphile.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

And, as I recall, in GODZILLA RAIDS AGAIN, they mention the Anguirusaurus. &nbsp;They call it 'Anguirusaurus, killer of the living.'

[ALLOSAURZ]

Actually according to GRA Anguirus isn't a mutation. He actually is from a species of dinosaur called Angillasaurus, and he was naturally his size. All the H-Bomb did was revive/awaken etc. But they specifically explain his origins in GRA

[Halomek]

I tend to think that the reason Toho had Baby-G eating roses was so he'd appeal more to the kids. Seeing a baby dinosaur eat a bloody carcass just doesn't have the same cuteness factor as munching on roses. They even went a step further in the next movie with Little Godzilla, perhaps the most chibi-ized kaiju ever (if he wasn’t kid friendly, I don’t know what is).

But in canon terms, I think the idea of the Godzillasaur being an omnivore has some merits. Baby-G did start off eating plants, but once he grew into Jr. he was killing whales for food.

[Darth Reaper]

Here's something that I'm debating with myself about, is Anguirus really a dinosaur? Has anyone else noticed that at least all of the major dinosaur predators were two-legged? Tyranosaurus Rex, Allosaurus, Velociraptor, Gorgosaurus, etc., they all walk on two bird-like legs. Anguirus does not.

Now, I can think of a few explanations for this:

a) Anguirus comes from a completely new species of dinosaur, one that has yet to be discovered by man, and is unlike anything that man has seen before. These animals were predators, but unlike most other predatory dinosaurs, they were quadrupeds.

b) Anguirus comes from a very old species of dinosaur. Perhaps, he's even a proto-dinosaur.

c) Anguirus isn't a dinosaur at all. Like Rodan, Anguirus is actually a mutated prehistoric reptile whose species coexisted with the dinosaurs. I've been playing with the idea that Anguirus actually comes from an ancient species of crocidilians. Due to mutation, or perhaps as a natural adaptation, the bony growths that many crocidilians have on their backs became overdeveloped on these animals, until they fused together and formed a protective shell on their backs. Also, they developed horns on the backs of their heads. Presto, Anguirus. Perhaps, instead of Anguirusaurus, Anguirus' species should be called Anguirusuchus.

However, I'm also playing with the idea of reimagining Anguirus as a herbivore. He'd come from a species of dinosaur that's related to the Ankylosaurus. Like rhinos, these animals would be feirce and tough, filled to the brim with will, determination, and fighting spirit; they just don't eat meat. Does that sound alright, or should Anguirus remain a predator?

[HolyGoji777]

angilasaur! i love it!

[Mageman.exe]

My theory is that Anguirus is a descendant of the ankylosaurs. Most ankylosaurs had small heads and short front legs. Anguirus has a larger head and long front legs. I read in a book about dinosaurs once that the last ankylosaur species to evolve before their extinction had larger heads and longer front legs. Most dinosaurs with large heads were carnivores, because they need big skulls for their jaw muscles. Some ankylosaurs survived extinction and lived on small islands in the Pacific Ocean. Many species that live on islands either become dwarves or giants overtime. The ankylosaurs evolved into Anguirus' species and became giants over time. I know that no species of animals ever became that large in real life, but this is science fiction we're talking about.

[biochemitra]

I'm not sure how credible this is but I remember hearing somewhere that anguirus was a distant relative of the godzillasaur family.

[kent]

In GRA, they did say he was part of a species called Angurisaurus. I don't recall anywhere in any of the films that said he was related to Ankylosaurus.

What you might be thinking of Baryonyx is Ib Melchior and Ed Watson's Volcano Monsters. They were going to make a film about a T-Rex (Godzilla) battling an Ankylosaurus (Anguirus). The story was something COMPLETELY different from GRA. What Melchior and Watson planned to do was take out certain clips of Godzilla and Anguirus fighting and join them in with their film. Toho even sent them similar looking Godzilla and Anguirus suits to do some scenes of their own.

[Darth Reaper]

People are also overlooking the differences between Ang from GRA and the rest of the Showa Series.

Such as the division of the carapace, in GRA its split down the middle, all other Angs dont have this.

The carapace in GRA is also &quot;loose,&quot; it just flops around on his back like a cape, in the rest of the Showa series, this doesnt happen as the carapace is clearly attached to the rest of the body.

Just something to consider.- Saruman

Of course, Godzilla often looked different from one movie to the next during the Showa Era, but we all seem to be fairly certain that it's the same monster king.

A creature's teeth are evolved towards eating the food they live on, not fighting other creatures (unless, of course, they're a carnivore).- Husnock

That's not entirely true. Hippos are herbivores, but they also have long, nasty tusks which are designed for fighting.

[Darth Reaper]

Here's something that's been making me curious for some time now. Anguirus is generally portrayed as a mutated version of a carnivorous dinosaur that walks on four legs. The thing is, all of the predatory dinosaurs that I can recall walked on two legs. T-Rex, Allosaurus, Velociraptor, Gorgosaurus, and the list goes on, all of them walked on two legs. So, that makes me wonder, what is Anguirus deal, besides being a completely fictional character that is.

One theory that I've concidered is that Anguirus represents a unique species of carnivorous dinosaur that took a different evolutionary path than most others.

Another theory is that Anguirus represents a very primitive form of dinosaur, one that developed way back when Dinosaurs were first starting to evolve.

My final theory, Anguirus isn't a dinosaur at all. Like Rodan, he represents a different species of reptile that coexisted with the dinosaurs. Lord knows people often mistakenly refer to Pterosaurs as dinosaurs, perhaps they've been doing the same thing to Anguirus. I sometimes like to play with the idea that Anguirus is actually a member of an ancient species of crocodilian that existed millions of years ago.

What do you guys think? Which of my theories do you think works best, or do you have a theory of your own that you'd like to share? Talk to me.

[Tokyo VigilanteX]

Dimetrodon was a 4 legged carnivore, and Anguirus probably wasn't a 'true' Dinosaur, but a more tradional reptile. I'd go with some variety of crcodillian myself.