Insect Kaiju Underrated?

EternalMothra · #1 November 8th, 2005, 03:40 PM

Is it just me or does insect kaiju seem to be underrated all the time?

biochemitra · #2 November 8th, 2005, 03:48 PM

All the time?

maybe not.

Alotta the time? Heck yeah! I'v heard megaguirus listed on the top ten weakest godzilla monsters thread. Worse yet, I'v heard someone refer to her as among the likes of kamacuras or manda(Sorry manda fans, He said it not me)...Truely shameful...

Ebirah, who I consider a bug kaiju since he's an arthropod, also seems underrated. I mean he's really not very powerful but he really would have been quite a challenge if Kong fought him, nearly drowning him as the script showed.

Battra's Imago form also often seems to be the subject of underration. I mean He took a decent amount of hits before croaking. The finisher hitting him in an open neck wound.

It's shameful because insects are not only one of the worlds greatest successes but at such a great size they would be a nightmare for anything to face!

EternalMothra · #3 November 8th, 2005, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biochemitra

All the time?

maybe not.

Alotta the time? Heck yeah! I'v heard megaguirus listed on the top ten weakest godzilla monsters thread. Worse yet, I'v heard someone refer to her as among the likes of kamacuras or manda(Sorry manda fans, He said it not me)...Truely shameful...

Ebirah, who I consider a bug kaiju since he's an arthropod, also seems underrated. I mean he's really not very powerful but he really would have been quite a challenge if Kong fought him, nearly drowning him as the script showed.

Battra's Imago form also often seems to be the subject of underration. I mean He took a decent amount of hits before croaking. The finisher hitting him in an open neck wound.

It's shameful because insects are not only one of the worlds greatest successes but at such a great size they would be a nightmare for anything to face!

Yeah, I've seen Mothra underrated as well.....People obviously hate the fact that she can beat monsters like Godzilla or King Ghidorah. Battra is really underrated too. He probably put up one of the most even fights with Godzilla in the entire Heisei series, like the battle underwater. Also the Imago put up a great fight, the only advantage Godzilla got was blasting fire into his face, and biting onto the insect's neck. Look at all the other kaiju out there, there isn't one that I see underrated as much as insects, besides perhaps Death Ghidorah......

Roehm · #4 November 8th, 2005, 03:54 PM

Yeah you are very right actually, I mean aside from Mothra, Legion and some others all the ones I have seen in movies are fairly weak. I suppose it would just be human mentality...I mean all we see bugs as a weak small creatures that couldn't easily be stepped on and done away with. So I actually think that this translates over the the movies we put them in and im sure that not all of it is on purpose im sure sometimes its just sub-conscious. These are however just assumtions, I really have nothing to back this with other than the movies themselves...the other insect Kaiju that really seem to be powerful ones seem to be always based off of spiders...obviously being because a large amount of people see spiders as a threat when most of them really couldn't do any real harm to a person. But like I said im sure its just something that has been burned into our sub-conscious...but don't take my word for it....Bahh doo bop!

Samzilla · #5 November 8th, 2005, 03:54 PM

With the exception of the Kamacuras, all bug Kaiju have shown themselves to be among the deadliest of foes. Kumonga would have killed Godzilla were it not for that meddling Minya.

Does Destoroyah count as a bug?

biochemitra · #6 November 8th, 2005, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Does Destoroyah count as a bug?

Tough call...I lay awake at night wondering the same thing really...

I consider ebirah a bug because he is a crustacean.

Insects, arachnids, diolpods and chilopods are all considered bugs, now I'm sure the definition of bug is not all arthropods besides crustaceans and since waterbugs are also considered bugs then aquatic arthropods such as lobsters, crabs and shrimp are bugs as well.

Now destroyah is a form of mutated crustacean as well. On the other hand, bio photos show that des is actually a vertibrate...a vertibrate with no lungs and an exoskeleton...if she were an insect she would still be a bug but crustaceans are more controversial. If we count megaguirus, a creature that is part reptile, as a bug then a vertibrate creature such as des would probably still be a bug. She may not seem like it at all but I think she should be labeled as a VERY odd bug daikaiju.

Yeah, this anology has been pre-prepared.

EternalMothra · #7 November 8th, 2005, 04:06 PM

Well, we know that Destroyah is not underrated. But as to Destroyah, she sort of seems like some kind of mutated, gaseous life form, or mutated from a gas. Micro-oxygen life form. Kind of hard to describe.

biochemitra · #8 November 8th, 2005, 04:13 PM

Des is not actually a gas. The des cloud is made of the displaced cells as they separate and reassemble.

Enshohma · #9 November 8th, 2005, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samzilla

Does Destoroyah count as a bug?

Destroyah is a mutant monster from the ancient times of the Precambrian era, an age where only the seas had life and the vast majority of such were arthropod, so I guess he count's, though not an a pure 100% insect kaiju like Mothra, Kamacuras, Megaguiras, the Meganurons, the Giant Fly, El Gusano Gigante, Queen Bee, Mutant Termites, the Energy Beast, Legion, Water Beetle, Millipede, Skeetera, Cicada / Megapede, Centipor, Lepirax, Inagos the Locust King and maybe Megalon?

Also if we get even more technical, there's the arachnid monsters; Kumonga, Spider Uros, Giant Spider from "Valley of the Giants", Sasori, First Wave, Second Wave, Scorpio, and the Black Widow.

While on the subject of Precambrian based monsters like Destroyah, there was also the killer Shokilas or 'Sea Lice' from "Godzilla 1985", a Dark Horse comic's take on the creature in the issue "Claim the Highest Monster" and the original Trilobite from "Godzilla, King of the Monsters" that inspired those two, not to mentioned the resurrected bio-mechanical Trilobite from "Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla".

I could off load an even BIGGER list of arachnid / insect monsters, but you all have probably suffered enough.

Oh, didn't "Varan" have some larger then average butterflies as well, though only viewed as one captured corpse?

biochemitra · #10 November 8th, 2005, 04:36 PM

Quote:

like Mothra, Kamacuras, Megaguiras, the Meganurons, the Giant Fly, El Gusano Gigante, Queen Bee, Mutant Termites, the Energy Beast, Legion, Water Beetle, Millipede, Skeetera, Cicada / Megapede, Centipor, Lepirax, Inagos the Locust King and maybe Megalon?

Megs isn't all bug though. She's part reptile. Namely godzilla.

Raptor · #11 November 8th, 2005, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biochemitra

All the time?

maybe not.

Alotta the time? Heck yeah! I'v heard megaguirus listed on the top ten weakest godzilla monsters thread. Worse yet, I'v heard someone refer to her as among the likes of kamacuras or manda(Sorry manda fans, He said it not me)...Truely shameful...

I agree.

I thought Megaguirus was an awesome opponent for Goji; scary, viscious, fast. The whole idea of such a creature is scary IMO and she did give Godzilla a lot of grief. I just can't see her being so under-rated myself.

Orga777 · #12 November 8th, 2005, 08:30 PM

......Since when are crustations listed under insects? Did I miss something? But no insect kaiju are not underrated. Heck some are overrated. Like Mothra Leo for example or Battra larva. Sure some like Battra adult get less respect than they deserve they are not underrated too much. Most are around average like Megaguirus, GFW Kamacuras, GMMG Mothra, and Megalon.

biochemitra · #13 November 8th, 2005, 09:38 PM

Quote:

......Since when are crustations listed under insects? Did I miss something?

EM meant bugs in general. Kumonga is counted as an insect kaiju despite that even my dog can tell you that he is an arachnid.
A lobster is a crustacean is an arthropod is a bug.

Bigmatt · #14 November 9th, 2005, 07:00 PM

Insect Kajiu are highly underatted, to the point that on this form many of them have been exclueded from the Kajiu battle forum. For instace The Deadly Mantis or the Ants from them. Has anyone ever cosnidered what a real praying mantis would do a lizard that was porportionally the same size as her. And ants can lift 50x their own body weight. Conider the ants from Them, if one ant weighed say a ton for agrumets sake, then each Ant could lift 50 tons then multiple that by the fact that there's a whole colony of ants. I'm not campaiging for the ants to be let into battle but definetly other insects should be.

Enshohma · #15 November 9th, 2005, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigmatt

Insect Kajiu are highly underatted, to the point that on this form many of them have been exclueded from the Kajiu battle forums

That or they don't like anything that's not a traditional, made-only-in-Japan, movie monster in that area.

Bigmatt · #16 November 9th, 2005, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enshohma

That or they don't like anything that's not a traditional, made-only-in-Japan, movie monster in that area.

I agree 100% its long been a peeve of mine that ONLY JAPAN makes giant monsters worth talking about. I would much rather see two 1950's American Giants insctecs bite and claw it out then see a Heisie beam fest.

Aragorn_Strider22 · #17 November 9th, 2005, 07:55 PM

*Looks at Legion and her record breaking DD finals streak.*

No, I don't believe ALL insects are underrated. However, several Mothras certainly are. Most Mothras were totally screwed over in the DD this year.

EternalMothra · #18 November 9th, 2005, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn_Strider22

*Looks at Legion and her record breaking DD finals streak.*

No, I don't believe ALL insects are underrated. However, several Mothras certainly are. Most Mothras were totally screwed over in the DD this year.

Yeah I know, every Mothra was screwed over. It seemed as though she was matched against every impossible foe to defeat out there. The only one that was close to winning was GFW Mothra.

Orga777 · #19 November 10th, 2005, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EternalMothra

Yeah I know, every Mothra was screwed over. It seemed as though she was matched against every impossible foe to defeat out there. The only one that was close to winning was GFW Mothra.

Thats what happens when they are a bunch of larvas and not the adults.

EternalMothra · #20 November 10th, 2005, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orga777

Thats what happens when they are a bunch of larvas and not the adults.

There were two larvas and two adults if I remember correctly.

Raptor · #21 November 10th, 2005, 02:16 PM

For the nomination phase, we had (Mothra-wise):

79. Mothra (GMK)
80. Mothra (Heisei)
81. Mothra (Kiryu)
82. Mothra (Rebirth)
83. Mothra-Leo (Rebirth)
84. Mothra-Aqua (Rebirth)
85. Mothra-Rainbow (Rebirth)
86. Mothra-Armored (Rebirth)
87. Mothra (Showa)
88. Mothra Larva (Showa)
89. Mothra Larva (Heisei)
90. Mothra Larva (Rebirth)
91. Mothra Larva (GMK)
92. Mothra Larva (Cretaceous)
93. Mothra Larva (SOS)

Of those, Megaguirus, Battra, Legion, Destroyah, Dagarah (kind of buggy), Kumonga and Mothra (Kiryu) made the Top 32 cut.

Remaining Vote Getters:

36. Mothra (GMK) - 4
40. Mothra (Heisei) - 3
42. Kamacuras - 2
47. Megalon - 2 (buggy)
55. Mothra (Showa) - 1

Non-Vote Getting Kaiju:

Ebirah

(last minute inclusions)

Kamacuras (GFW)
Kumonga (GFW)
Ebirah (GFW)
Mothra (GFW)

Blackballed Negative TIN Kaiju:

Mothra (Rebirth) - -1

With only 10 slots to vote on and "one of a species" limits, getting a ballot together presents a lot of tough choices for DD.
How about we adjourn to Kaiju Karnage O-o-O and have a BUG FEST tourney? HERE is your list of kaiju to work with. Make a Discussion topic over there and we'll see about lining something out.

I would suggest that you incorporate some way for the larvae to transform to a more "durable" stage (maybe after winning their first battle), even if it does result in two of a kind.

packmule · #22 November 12th, 2005, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EternalMothra

Is it just me or does insect kaiju seem to be underrated all the time?

Underrated? Maybe. Uneven? Even more. By that I mean the suits and the way Toho has employed them in these movies. The Kamakiras in SOG(1967) appear, in some scenes, flimsy(even as giant insects) and not surprisingly are killed easily by Godzilla(Kumonga killing the other). Kumonga in SOG is genuinely menacing-looking, and backs up his appearance by menacing the scientists and Minya, then trying to spray G himself. Megaguirus is a better insect kaiju rendition, but aside from its' stinger it has no other lethal weapon to employ against Godzilla.The Kamakiras in GFW is to me nothing but cannon fodder for Godzilla, something to be swatted or squashed as, again, it has no special powers. The strongest of the insect kaiju remains Mothra, who throughout her film career has been portrayed fairly consistently: benevolent unless provoked, with varying special powers and abilities depending on the movie. Mothra is the one constant strong insect kaiju from Toho.